Paper Mario Color Splash revealed.

Well if ya continue to believe that? But yeah Nintendo seem to be treating it as SS2 but who know what they are planning with it.

*shrugs* i still think it's a waste of energy to be upset about it. but i've said before in another thread that i loved everything about sticker star.

i think it's hard sometimes for people to accept change into a fandom/series ever. with my experiences with animal crossing, people will literally tear apart a new game in that series until it comes out and then they all obsess over it - then a year later, they start complaining again about something about it. i remember when they announced new leaf, people were complaining because the "logo was stupid." and they were so up in arms about it, they acted like they weren't even going to touch the game. it was ridiculous.

your games are not going to always be the same with each sequel - it's part of evolution.

again, as you said things, things could change with more info, though.

You loved Sticker Star, it's ok and i have no problem with that but many didn't.

What make them angry is that for their point of view, Nintendo changed the wrong things (classic PM elements, battle system, Original characters) and keep the bad things (the so called "Generic New Super Mario Bros" elements) and seem to have kept this idea for Color Splash.

It's basically an extention of the Standarization (AKA NSMBification) problem (Nintendo have been standarizing some mainstream elements which according to some fans's resulted a loss of quality for the Mario games because the developpers couldn't be fully creative)

Still did seem to have a feedback problem, they listened to Miyamoto and did some bad club nintendo survey.

So it ended up badly implemented as they were basically taking a shot in the dark (didn't help that 90% of the staff was new)

PJ definitely improved the SS mechanics for sure.

But again, the common complain (even among official review and critics) is that it's too "generic", alway the same reusing of Toads, not much story, not much personality nor immersion.

Similar complains appeared with Paper Jam (Reviewers and fans both said the gameplay and humor were top notch but the settings and character's variety were too "bland")

Who know ? Maybe Sticker Star would have been better recevied if they had a better immersion, story and characters variety even with the new experimental gameplay (having a good immersion can help to make the flaws of a game less glaring)

Well, Sticker Star was confirmed rushed (devs mentionned they couldn't do Bowser's castle puzzles before meeting the deadline)

PJ is also hinted to be rushed (IRC they ran out of time when working on the scenario + the game reuse lot of assets and is very glitchy)

I'd like them to follow Miyamoto's quote "A delayed game is eventually good, a bad game is bad forever".

I do hope they won't make the same mistake and actually listen to feedback.

It do not matter if they delay it, if they can listen to the various comments and work the game into something enjoyable in response, it will be worth the delay.

True, i've noticed that Ryota Kawade, the director of the 3 first PM left somewhere prior SS developpement.

Idk through according to some fans, it might be related to Tanabe (he joined around SPM developpement and since then he has supervised the PM series)

Kawade did participate to Codename:STEAM's developpement through.

Make me wonder if Tanabe is more responsible for the rather questionable choices recent PMs suffer instead of Miyamoto :/

Yeah, seem like reforming almost completly the team with newbies only led to a mess.

Hence why i hope Kawade could come back, he directed the first 3 PMs, so he could tip the team on to make a proper Paper Mario.

Super Paper Mario's story is baaaad, I'd rather have Sticker Star's story. Keep Dark Prognostics crap out of Mario games. Or any games in general. Sticker Star might've had a bad story, but its characterization were bigger issues. Bowser and Luigi were stripped of their personalities, and the only friendly NPCs we got are red generic Toads. We also got generic Mario worlds too. It's just recycling them from the New Super Mario Bros. series and not doing anything interesting to it. But I'd rather have that than geometry world.

The story in Super Paper Mario... is interesting. Well, interesting in the sense that regardless of whether it's good or not, it doesn't really feel like a Mario story.

Seriously, if you took out the Mario references and stuck it in a book, it would feel a fairly generic fantasy story that no one would even recognise as Mario related. The only story thing you'd have to change would be the Bitlands and Fort Francis...

But do you know what it does remind me of? Doctor Who. Like, the new series version.

Think about it. The Void concept was basically done in series 5 with the Time Fields erasing people and things from existence and the universe nearly collapsing in on itself as a result. The idea of saving the world by bringing about hope (in this game as well as Thousand Year Door) was done in series 3 of Doctor Who. And the individual chapters remind me an awful lot of the individual episodes in a season. They've got a tangential relationship to the overall story 'arc', but each come with their own neat setup, villain and problem to solve. Like the plantation esque mansion in chapter 2 with its slavery overtones and the prehistoric chapter 5 with its 'green aesop' and the whole heaven and hell/afterlife concept for series 7.

Either way, it would have probably worked better as an alternate series 5/6 of Doctor Who than as a Mario game storyline.

On another note, does anyone somewhat think that the game comes across as slightly... less than coherent in how everything fits together? You've got a storyline and ideas that to some degree, seem like they were meant for a 'serious' story aimed at an older audience. You've got a bunch of Mario NPCs and references that don't really seem to fit any of these settings, but were included to make it feel less generic. The NPCs and most new enemies come across as random abstract shapes that don't seem to fit any of the settings all that well either. And then you've got random ideas and humour that doesn't really fit with any of the above.

As for how a Mario RPG's story and characters should work. Well, somewhat like Thousand Year Door or Superstar Saga. In a way where there are interesting new characters and ideas, everyone has interesting personalities and interactions with each other but where the tone of the game mostly remains on the 'fun' side rather than the 'ultra dark/dreary' side. Sticker Star had no personality, boring characters and ideas and nothing interesting going on. Paper Jam was... not much better, but at least gave everyone some semblance of a personality. Partners in Time felt too dark in general, and Super Paper Mario felt like it took things a tad too seriously as well.

That's the problem, it has some good ideas but it try to be too serious to really work.

Mario games aren't exactly supposed to be dark and deep stories, maybe they can have a few more serious moments there and there but they are mostly fun and lighthearted overall.

Imo, the main problem of SS is how they went the complete opposite of SPM, the game has litterally no personality outside of "dude Paper lmao", i don't ask for a deep story but i'd like something creative and enjoyable that i can invest myself in it.


It's a reference to a 4chan meme.

Basically when a poster post an opinion very similar to another poster, they like to refer it as T. "insert original poster name" as if the poster was the previous one wearing a different name (in this case i called Mario "T. Mrbowser" because he had a similar opinion than Mrbowser toward SPM )

T. Mean "regards" in Finnish.

It is through it still tried to keep a "Mario feel" with some humor and characters that fit the Mario world.

SPM feel like at time as if they've made completly different game then slapped Mario in it.